Pathfinder One Shot - Sunday April 22nd

Anyone want to try a one shot for Sunday evening, April 22nd? I am on US East coast time (GMT -5.)



I've never used Epic Table in anger and I've only played Pathfinder once. But I just bought the Pathfinder beginner box and the Pathfinder Core Rules and I'm keen to try em out. I'd like to GM the short adventure in the beginner box as a one shot Epic Table / Pathfinder learning experience. You could probably talk me into doing just about anything FRPG D20 based.



I have lots of experience GMing D&D 2e from back in the old days, and was recently involved in a long running campaign using another virtual tabletop that I eventually left because I felt like I was battling the user interface. The Epic Table appears to be a massive improvement, is intuitive, and does not try to implement all the myriad rule sets at the expense of simplicity.

Comments

  • Heck i will play with ya, can even get another as well. Never played pathfinder either.
  • Galeric;2619 wrote: Heck i will play with ya, can even get another as well. Never played pathfinder either.


    Great. Bring your other. The beginner box has some pre-gen 1st level characters to use. But feel free to create your own if you prefer. What time is good for you?
  • Anyone else? One or two more would be welcome.
  • Ok you have 2 for sure, possibly a 3rd. Not sure on the 3rd just yet. Will talk to her tonight when i run my game.



    We are both West coasters, so i will let you set the time, but make it after 3pm if possible.
  • Sounds fine. Lets try for 6pm west coast time. That's 9pm east coast. Really looking forward to trying out Epic Table. I'll send you some details via private message.
  • Hey guys, I'm always working on EpicTable at night and often Sunday afternoons. If you see me on Skype or Google+ (both johnalammers) and have questions during/after your game, please feel free to contact me.
  • Awesome John. Thanks.
  • uhh well, i see you sent me a private message, but i can not get the private messages to open.... Perhaps a hammer, or pry-bar? i click and click and click, and it never opens... JOHN HELP!



    Not to worried about bad folks, but .. [email]galericx@gmail.com[/email]
  • Try clicking harder! Or just send me your email address. AlternatePorridgegmail.com
  • Added a 3rd for the fun.
  • Clicking harder might work. I think it helps if you sing while you click, too. :rolleyes:



    Actually, an update broke my theme a bit, but I'm starting a theme refresh/redesign, so I've been reluctant to spend time fixing it. (That and having EpicTable to finish.)



    I know for a fact that there are broken links. However, the way I get to my private messages is the link at the top:

  • Hey guys,

    I have beta-19 almost ready. An early build of it has been through two of my groups' sessions, and is in pretty decent shape. I'm trying to address one more thing, and then I'll post it to the broader audience. I know I'm racing against the clock on this one, to get it out before your group plays, and I really want you using beta-19 instead of 18.



    The first beta-19 build is silently available, so if all else fails, use that. Don't download it too early, though, because I'm going to try to replace that with another, slightly better build before you play tonight, so stay tuned.
  • Go ahead and use beta 19 release candidate 1 for tonight. The update I want to get in before releasing beta-19 is taking a little longer than expected.



    The main thing missing that I want in 19 is the ability to reassign characters.
  • Will do, thanks a bunch
  • Playtest Report



    Four of us had a blast playing Epic Table last night. We got about halfway though the Pathfinder Beginner Box adventure in a couple hours. None of us had ever used Epic Table and none of us had ever played Pathfinder, so this was a challenge for the software.



    John (the developer) showed up and chatted with us at the end of the game. We had some minor issues, some questions, and way too many enhancement requests. Thanks very much John for spending time with us.



    After playtesting, Epic Table, I'm sold. This is by far the easiest to use and most intuitive VT on the market. And I think I've tried em all. See below for specifics. I will follow up this post with appropriate entries in the support forum, but I wanted to include it here in case someone wants to read it all in one go.



    Initial Impressions

    - Port 80 comms with a server on the internet to route the shared data is a must for a virtual tabletop. All the other VTs should be doing this. Epic Table will get lots of customers that other VTs cannot touch because of setup issues.

    - I really like the concept of having a virtual table that I own, and I can invite people to it. From what I have read in the forums, I think I am going to like the pricing model. I’m happy to pay for the VT, but I play with people that will balk at spending anything on software. So selling the game to a single person and allowing players to join his game for free makes good sense to me.

    - I really like that Epic Table decided not to get involved with implementing rulesets for specific games. Implementing rulesets takes time that is better spent on providing a quality, easy to use product. I’ve used Fantasy Grounds in the past, and I wrestled with the gui to do simple tasks like just moving a frigging token. I really just want to be able to create my map, place my tokens, and roll some dice. Everything else is gravy.

    - Ribbon control on the top of the gui is excellent. I like the way the choices for a particular display are grouped for me.

    - The method for inviting players to the game is good. Simple and effective.

    - We were all impressed wit the dice roller. The concept of Dice Cups and setting up Dice Cups for specific actions was simple and intuitive and faster than you might think after we got used to it.

    Minor issues, inconveniences

    - The responsiveness to pan and drawing is poor when the map is zoomed in or out. It seems to respond best at 100% zoom.

    - Dragging images around on the map was a little wonky. The image wants to move a bit when you drop it. The drop coordinates need to be more precise. Sometimes I just want to move the image over 1 or 2 pixels (I know, I have a problem.)

    - Dragging images when zoomed in or out was comical. When zoomed in, the image wants to go too far. When zoomed out, the image won’t move far enough.

    - There is too much white space in the chat log. I found myself scrolling way back in the log to examine a die roll or a chat from one of the players. This may only be my preference as the extra white space does make the chat log very readable.

    - Extremely minor issue: The Image Icon on the ribbon to add a background for maps is different from the image icon on the ribbon to add a background for a tabletop. They should probably be the same. I thought, at first, that they did different things, because the icon was different.



    Questions

    - Strange that I have to go to the tabletop tab to place an image on my map. Is this intentional?

    - I was unsure how to switch the private/public property of a map or tabletop. I eventually figured out that I needed to remove a public map, then click on it from the gallery and add it back as private. Not sure of a better way to handle this. Maybe right click on the map tab for properties? Or perhaps another control on the ribbon? Same goes for tabletops and characters. Am I doing this the right way?

    - Once you select a background for a map, how do you remove it?

    - How do I set my portrait in the chat window? I could not figure out how to do it. Not the portrait for a character, but the portrait for me.



    Major Issues

    - The relative positions of the map and the character tokens can suddenly change on some players screen. The problem seemed to trigger when one person (not necessarily the GM) switched in and out of drawing mode. We were able to get the screen to refresh and properly position all the tokens by exiting the game and logging back in. John later suggested simply entering drawing mode, drawing a tiny line and then exiting drawing mode. That worked too.



    Enhancement Wish List

    - Get rid of the Pan and Select buttons for the map. If I click on the map, I want to pan. If I click on an object, I want to select. John showed us that holding the space bar and moving the mouse made the game pan. But I still think the Pan and Select buttons are unnecessary complications.

    - Zoom the map in and out with the mouse wheel. This is common to other mapping software like google maps.

    - Compress the chat log so that we can see more history without scrolling.

    - Fog of War – probably the only major feature lacking in Epic Table. I need this even more than I need an initiative tracker. For now, I'm drawing the dungeon as we go.
  • Wow! Thanks for the detailed write-up. Thanks even more for submitting almost every one of these as individual support tickets. I know that's a pain, and duplication of effort, but it really helps me a lot to have it all tracked. All of your issues are recorded on the support site. I added a couple extra on your behalf for the few things I found here that you hadn't already written up.



    For the sake of the people here, I'll briefly respond to these here in the forum, but continue the per-issue conversation over on the support site.
  • DavidB;2643 wrote:

    The responsiveness to pan and drawing is poor when the map is zoomed in or out. It seems to respond best at 100% zoom.
    I observed this when I was online with you guys. It hasn't always been that way. I'll figure out what's caused it.

    DavidB;2643 wrote: Dragging images around on the map was a little wonky. The image wants to move a bit when you drop it. The drop coordinates need to be more precise. Sometimes I just want to move the image over 1 or 2 pixels (I know, I have a problem.)
    I'm aware of this one. I'll address it, but in the meantime, you need to bump it a pixel or two, you can do that with the arrow keys. Just make sure snap-to-grid is off or you'll bump it a whole grid square. (On the other hand, precise positioning isn't a problem when snap to grid is on.)

    DavidB;2643 wrote: Dragging images when zoomed in or out was comical. When zoomed in, the image wants to go too far. When zoomed out, the image won’t move far enough.
    This is a bad one. Like the zoom sluggishness, this is new. I need to find out when/how it was introduced.

    DavidB;2643 wrote: There is too much white space in the chat log. I found myself scrolling way back in the log to examine a die roll or a chat from one of the players. This may only be my preference as the extra white space does make the chat log very readable.
    Got it. There are similar requests for smaller dice images in the chat window, aimed at achieving the same goal.

    DavidB;2643 wrote: Extremely minor issue: The Image Icon on the ribbon to add a background for maps is different from the image icon on the ribbon to add a background for a tabletop. They should probably be the same. I thought, at first, that they did different things, because the icon was different.
    Yep. It should be consistent. Nice catch.

    DavidB;2643 wrote: Strange that I have to go to the tabletop tab to place an image on my map. Is this intentional?
    Actually, I'm planning on consolidating the Map and Tabletop tabs. While they're conceptually separate items, the things you want to do with them are largely the same, and it's weird to have to bounce between tabs.

    DavidB;2643 wrote: I was unsure how to switch the private/public property of a map or tabletop. I eventually figured out that I needed to remove a public map, then click on it from the gallery and add it back as private. Not sure of a better way to handle this. Maybe right click on the map tab for properties? Or perhaps another control on the ribbon? Same goes for tabletops and characters. Am I doing this the right way?
    Yes. What your doing is the only way. I plan to add a right-click menu item to allow you to switch between public and private.

    DavidB;2643 wrote: Once you select a background for a map, how do you remove it?
    You don't remove it--you just change it. Maps and tabletops always have a background. You can set it to any of the supplied textures or provide your own map as a backing image.

    DavidB;2643 wrote: How do I set my portrait in the chat window? I could not figure out how to do it. Not the portrait for a character, but the portrait for me.
    You can't right now, but that's on the to-do list. What some people do is just create a character for themselves, but that gets a little cluttered if everyone does it.

    DavidB;2643 wrote: Major Issue: The relative positions of the map and the character tokens can suddenly change on some players screen. The problem seemed to trigger when one person (not necessarily the GM) switched in and out of drawing mode. We were able to get the screen to refresh and properly position all the tokens by exiting the game and logging back in. John later suggested simply entering drawing mode, drawing a tiny line and then exiting drawing mode. That worked too.
    There's something here having to do with drawing (and I believe limited to drawing). Specifically, the updates sent from the user doing the drawing are seeming to cause this. This is near the top of my list.

    DavidB;2643 wrote: Get rid of the Pan and Select buttons for the map. If I click on the map, I want to pan. If I click on an object, I want to select. John showed us that holding the space bar and moving the mouse made the game pan. But I still think the Pan and Select buttons are unnecessary complications.
    EpicTable doesn't pan by default when you click and drag because that gesture lets you do a lasso select of multiple objects, which is pretty important in its own right.

    DavidB;2643 wrote: Zoom the map in and out with the mouse wheel. This is common to other mapping software like google maps.
    Open to discussion on this one. The counter argument is that scrolling with the mouse wheel is common on browsers and Office apps and drawing tools. In this apps Ctrl+mouse wheel is used to zoom, and that would be my personal preference, because I tear my hair out every time I try to scroll a Google Maps map and end up zooming way in or out. I think there's an argument to be made that EpicTable, even though it presents maps, isn't nearly as similar to Google Maps as it is to a diagramming tool. But again, I'm open to discussion on the support site.



    DavidB;2643 wrote: Fog of War – probably the only major feature lacking in Epic Table. I need this even more than I need an initiative tracker. For now, I'm drawing the dungeon as we go.
    This is probably the biggest outstanding 1.x feature.... I want to make sure everything else is solid before I open up vision/fog-of-war testing. Stay tuned for a larger post and discussion about the timing of vision/fog-of-war.
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